How Can I Repay the Lord?

Twelve Wicker Baskets welcomes Bishop James Golka of the Diocese of Colorado Springs for a rich and thoughtful conversation on gratitude, stewardship and Eucharistic living. Bishop Golka reflects on psalm 116 and the act of taking up the cup of salvation and calling upon the name of the Lord as a gesture of profound worship and thanksgiving—an invitation to live a life rooted in the Eucharist.

Bishop Golka shares insights from his own pastoral journey and spiritual formation, shaped by years of service in the Diocese of Grand Island, Nebraska, where he was ordained a priest in 1994. Raised in a large Catholic family as one of ten siblings, he developed an early appreciation for stewardship as gratitude, and a deep sense of vocation. His background in parish ministry, combined with his early experience as pastor of a large parish and school in Seward, Nebraska, his reflections on how the Eucharist calls each person to offer his or her life in service, gratitude and stewardship.

Appointed Bishop of Colorado Springs by Pope Francis in 2021, Bishop Golka speaks with warmth and humility about the joys and challenges of episcopal ministry. He explores how living Eucharistically transforms one’s perspective on time, resources and relationships—shaping not just personal spirituality, but the communal life of the Church. Throughout the conversation, Bishop Golka’s love for Christ and the Church shines through, inviting listeners into a deeper response to God's abundant grace.

Further resources:

Stewardship: A Disciple’s Response by United States Conference of Catholic Bishops

Seeking God: The Way of St. Benedict by Esther de Waal

The Catholic Vision for Leading Like Jesus by Owen Phelps

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To contact the podcast, email twb@steiergroup.com.

Transcript

Christopher Beaudet: I'm Christopher Beaudet with the Steier Group. In the Gospel, Jesus fed 5,000 with only five loaves and two fish. After the crowd was satisfied, there were 12 wicker baskets left over. It seems that whenever you and I set to work and do our part, God provides the abundance.

In each episode of this podcast, I'll explore with pastoral leaders and development professionals from across the United States and Canada all the many ways God meets the spiritual and temporal needs of our parish communities, our Catholic schools and the diocesan church and not only meets those needs, but provides in abundance. You're listening to Twelve Wicker Baskets. We're very grateful you've joined us today on Twelve Wicker Baskets as we have a very special guest to discuss our theme, How Can I Repay the Lord? My guest today, Bishop James Golka, is the Bishop of the Diocese of Colorado Springs. Born in 1966 in Grand Island, Nebraska, Bishop Golka is the fourth of 10 children born to Robert and Patricia Golka. He graduated from Grand Island Central Catholic High School in 1985 and went on to Creighton University, where He graduated in 1989 with degrees in Philosophy and Theology. He then spent one year as a Jesuit lay missionary volunteer at the Red Cloud Indian School on the Native American Pine Ridge Reservation in South Dakota. After applying as a seminarian for his home diocese of Grand Island, Bishop Golka received his seminary formation at the St. Paul Seminary School of Divinity at the University of St. Thomas in St. Paul, Minnesota, where he received both a Master of Divinity degree and a Master's of Arts degree in Sacramental Theology. He was ordained a priest for the Diocese of Grand island on June 3, 1994. He was he has served as a parochial vicar and pastor in various parishes and has served the diocese in various capacities, including as Director of Ongoing Formation of Clergy, Chair of the Personnel Board, member of the Diocesan Finance Council, the Presbyteral Council, and as a member of the Diocesan College of Consultors. While serving as Rector of the Cathedral of the Nativity of the Blessed Virgin Mary in Grand Island and as Vicar General for the diocese was He was called by the Holy Father to serve as Bishop of Colorado Springs. He was installed as the third Bishop of Colorado Springs on June 29, 2021. He currently serves on the Subcommittee on Certification for Ecclesial Ministry and Service and is a member of the Committee for Child and Youth Protection of the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops. He served as a board member for several Catholic nonprofits and apostolates, including Cross Catholic Outreach, Catholic Rural Life and St. Gregory the Great Seminary in Seward, Nebraska. He is on the Bishop advisory board for Acts 29 apostolate, and for Teens Encounter Christ apostolate. Bishop Golka has worked with national consultants to better help parishes develop stewardship as a way of life. He has offered numerous retreats across the country, preaching the blessings of ordering our lives in recognition that all we are and all we have is a gift from God. A guiding scripture passage for him is Psalm 116, which proclaims, “How can I repay the Lord for all the great good done for me?” Bishop Golka, thank you so much for the gift of your time. I know you have a very busy schedule, as do all of our shepherds, so we really, really appreciate your being a guest today on Twelve Wicker Baskets.

Bishop James Golka: Hi, Christopher. It's great to be here. Thanks for inviting me.

Christopher Beaudet: Absolutely. Bishop, would you just start us in a prayer, please?

Bishop James Golka: Sure. Let us pray. In the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.

Christopher Beaudet: Amen.

Bishop James Golka: Lord God, we thank you for the many, many gifts you've given to us. We thank you for the gift of your Son, who's here with us. He redeems us, gives us your great mercy. Thank you for your spirit. We invite your Spirit to especially lead and direct and guide this conversation. And may your spirit touch the hearts of our listeners today, too, in whatever way you desire. So we just ask this blessing upon us as we give you gratitude for all of your good, in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.

Christopher Beaudet: Amen. Thank you very much. Bishop, I always like to ask our guests, you know, if you could share a little bit about, you know, your maybe, I guess, just a little bit of your journey. I know that you. You have a great reputation at ICSC and in other sectors to be a bishop very much in tune with the theology of stewardship, of gratefulness. And that's obviously going to be the theme of our, our conversation today. How did you come by that?

How did you come to this appreciation of stewardship in your own spiritual journey and vocational walk?

Bishop James Golka: Yeah, thanks for the great question. I've always found that gratitude touches the heart and opens the heart in a way like nothing else. And I probably learned that from my parents. So I'm one of 10 children, and my mom and dad just shared the faith with us by living it themselves.

So I don't remember them ever giving us a lecture in theology, but we just. I just watched them.

And one example, when my. When my mom's mom Died, I was about 12 years old, and I'm watching my mom thinking this is the worst day of her life. And she gathers us together, drives us to the parish, kneels in the front row and says out loud, I remember something like, dear God, thank you for the gift of my mom and our grandmother. She was an incredible gift to us. And now we give her back to you. We are so grateful.

Christopher Beaudet: Wow.

Bishop James Golka: And I remember like a 12-year-old looking at her, thinking, this must be how you do faith, right? And then in my life growing, I just knew that when I felt gratitude, my heart was enlarged somehow. I experienced God more clearly and I felt more alive. And briefly, I served as a priest for 27 years in western Nebraska Diocese of Grand Island. Correct? Yeah. My home diocese. And I grew up in the town of Grand Island.

Christopher Beaudet: Okay.

Bishop James Golka: And at one point, I was asked to go pastor a large parish that had a K-12  school and lots of financial burdens. And before I got there, the parish wanted to begin a stewardship initiative. And I remember I always wanted to do that, but I don't know if I had the courage to actually take that step of faith because you have to designate some financial resources and staff resources.

And I just wasn't sure how to do that. And I remember talking to our bishop at the time and I said, bishop, what do you think? Should I do that? He said, yeah, I think you should do that. I said, okay, then I do too. And I always thought that if it went badly, I could blame the bishop.

Christopher Beaudet: Right, Right, exactly.

Bishop James Golka: Yeah. So for 10 years that I pastored this parish in North Platte, St. Patrick's I just experienced, like, stewardship as a way of life and a stewardship council and doing annual renewals. All of that just gave me confidence that this is a way the church ought to be, and not for money's sake, but to see people get involved in the parish, to see people pray more, you could just sense that the spirit was alive in a way that it wasn't. And so as a pastor, I was so grateful for that help.

Christopher Beaudet: What do you think was the principal reason behind your reticence? Was it just the allocation of funds or you weren't sure that there'd be a return on that investment, pushback from the community?

Bishop James Golka: Probably all of that. It's funny because I was convicted that this is what I have to do, but I didn't know how to do it. So we had a consultant with us that helped us and kind of helped us map it out. And walked with us. And that, that helped a lot because I don't think I could have done that on my own. I know some priests do that on their own, and they do it really well, but I don't think I could have.

Christopher Beaudet: Yeah. And it seems like there's a lot of resources available today that maybe people aren't aware of. And by people, I mean the laity, parish leadership, but also pastors, even though, you know, if you ask them on the spot, what do you think about stewardship or what can you say about it? I think most priests would be pretty. Pretty communicative about its role and its purpose and its centrality to Christian discipleship. But sometimes, too, stewardship can seem like such a vague term or tough to get our hands around. Has that been your experience in the presentations and the catechesis and the work you've done?

Bishop James Golka: You know, it's funny when…so two things. When I'm able to speak about it with people who want to know about it, you can see people come alive because there's a language there. And stewardship, in my mind, too, cuts across the liberal, conservative divides in our Catholic faith. It's a spirituality that everyone can connect with. And then secondly, having a stewardship council that we can monthly study and pray and to see them come alive. So that very first thing we do is study the bishop's document, Stewardship: A Disciple’s Response, and to know that this way of life is going to help me grow as a disciple. So for me, it's all about Jesus. Like, if Christ is not central and if we're not growing closer to him by what we do, then we're doing the wrong thing.

Christopher Beaudet: And the stewardship council you mentioned, is that at the parish that you were at in Nebraska, do you have a diocesan stewardship council or…

Bishop James Golka: Yeah, thanks. So the two parishes, especially that we worked on stewardship in North Platte and then at the cathedral in Grand Island, I gathered accounts together that had not been formed before. And especially with them, it was fun to see them grow, like, become stewards, intentional stewards themselves, which meant they were intentional disciples. And so I believe in dual process. Like, if that small group is doing it, the whole parish will feel it.

Christopher Beaudet: Right.

Bishop James Golka: But if that. But if that small group, and if the priest is just giving lip service to it but not living it out, it's not going to work in the parish.

Christopher Beaudet: Okay.

Bishop James Golka: So it was fun to see people get energized and really want to be a better steward and a better disciple.

Christopher Beaudet: And that goes back to the witness of Your parents, I mean, if you can observe it, you judge a tree by its fruit. You saw the fruitful here. Your mom lost someone and went to the church and all she could say was thank you. I mean, that's…If you don't live like that day to day,

you're not going to respond like that to crisis moments.

Bishop James Golka: Amen. And I would say to our priests, I think, you know, our people can see right through us.

Christopher Beaudet: For good or for ill.

Bishop James Golka: Exactly. So if you're a grateful steward and a grateful leader, your parish is going to become grateful.

Christopher Beaudet: And to your point earlier, Bishop, you found yourself just more joyful, more light hearted, just less maybe own. I'm kind of paraphrasing now with my own words, maybe less onerous feeling of burdened amidst your responsibilities by being grateful because it, I guess, kept you oriented to living a life full of gifts.

Bishop James Golka: Exactly. Yeah. Gratitude shifts your focus from what I don't have to recognizing the abundance of gifts that God has given me that I didn't really, I wasn't aware of. And, and then the more grateful I am, the more I'm aware that God has given me even more. And then I get just overwhelmed and humbled, and all I can tell him is thank you. And so I love Psalm 116, you know, as we talked about, like, how can I ever repay the Lord for all the good he's done for me?

And the answer is, you never can. But it's really fun to try.

Christopher Beaudet: Persevere, hang in there and keep trying.

Bishop James Golka: Yeah. Because the more you try to return God's goodness, then the more God's goodness gets shared in the world. And I love Pope John Paul the Great talked about the law of the gift. And like a spiritual gift God has given, has to be shared and given away.

And so he says that your being increases in the measure that you give it away.

So, like, love increases in the measure you give it away, gratitude increases in the measure you give it away. And the image I have that liturgically is the sign of peace at Mass. It's a simple thing,

but, like, what are you doing at the sign of peace? You're giving away something that doesn't belong to you. It's the peace of Christ. And have you ever run out of the peace of Christ when you give it away?

Christopher Beaudet: Right.

Bishop James Golka: It increases.

Christopher Beaudet: Yeah, it's inexhaustible.

Bishop James Golka: You get filled up and then the whole church is full of the peace of Christ. And I think that's God's desire for the universe. We're called to go do that with the whole world.

Christopher Beaudet: Blessed are the peacemakers.

Bishop James Golka: Yeah, yeah.

Christopher Beaudet: You mentioned Psalm 116, and that was the origin, the font for our, the theme of our conversation today. How can I repay the Lord? Um, in some ways, that's a rhetorical question, like you said. Well, you can't. So yet that psalm gives voice to a consideration, a wonder that's in all of our hearts, because there's something in us, in the way, in our being, that wants to repay the Lord. And so we find ourselves questioning, how. How can I do that? We're not questioning,

should I repay the Lord, but how can I? And the psalm beautifully answers it. So it doesn't seem a rhetorical question only, but there is an answer. How can I repay the Lord? I will take up the cup of salvation and call upon the name of the Lord. And I've seen even that text inscribed in some chalices,

a very powerful Eucharistic reference, and of course, even the Greek Eucharistane to give thanks. So speak to that whole the way. Psalm 116 answers that question. How can I repay the Lord?

Bishop James Golka: Yeah. If you'd allow me, a quote from a book that I like a lot is by Kevin Seasoltz called God's Gift Giving, and kind of a thick book, but he's got some really great things in there. And so he has this quote. One of the great revelations of New Testament is that God lives primarily for giving, giving to the extent of giving. His only Son, who in turn gives the fullness of his life for his people. This initiative for giving comes always from God in Christ that giving is revealed as costly giving. Indeed, our response to that divine gift is meant to be Eucharist, which means to give thanks. And so God's nature is to give. And we're created in the image and likeness of God. And so we're only going to find out who we are by giving ourself away. And we always say that you're never going to know what gifts you have unless and until you give them away. Because if they're not given, it's not a gift, it's a possession. And we know that spiritual gifts die. They shrivel up if you don't share them. And so there's a sense then. And the Eucharist is precisely the place where all of that is realized in an encounter with Christ. And so communion isn't like a thing you get right. Communion is a way of being. And that that event of Christ giving himself to us fully, which he never ceases to do,

and then we are recipients of that gift. And by the giving and receiving of lives, like we get divine life given to us and it's our. It's our choice whether we receive that or not. And just in receiving that gift does something to our being that makes us more fully who God made us to be, if that makes sense.

Christopher Beaudet: Totally, absolutely. And I think of St. Augustine, too, who said that we become what we receive with the Eucharist, otherwise everything else we ingest, it becomes who we are. But with the Eucharist, we take the Lord in and we become more that which we have received, not only for ourselves, but that Lord that we become is the Lord and giver of life and the gift of God's own Son.

And there's the sign of peace connected directly before the rite of communion.

Bishop James Golka: Yeah. St. Augustine in his Confessions has that great encounter with God in prayer where Jesus tells him, if you eat an apple, the apple becomes part of you.

If you eat me, then you become part of me. So Christ turns it around and we get to share in his divine life.

Christopher Beaudet: When you said the Confessions, I thought you were going to quote, lord, make me chaste. Just not yet.

Bishop James Golka: That's my second favorite quote from the book.

Christopher Beaudet: Augustine had a gift of being very raw and very honest.

Bishop James Golka: That's why we need him.

Christopher Beaudet: That's right. That's right. Let me ask you. I'm going to take a brief break here in a moment, but before we do, you mentioned earlier that gratitude made you more joyful and made you more, you know, feeling more alive. What is it that you think can help people grow in that? And is it something that either you are gifted and therefore you're grateful, or you haven't received gifts that you wish you had, and therefore it's harder to be grateful? I guess the. I guess taking a step back, what I'm asking is, does everyone have the same cause to be just as grateful, or is it the case that some have caused to struggle with it? Does that make sense?

Bishop James Golka: I think so, yeah. My first image, as you described that is I was just in Guatemala on a mission trip, and we visited people who were living in squalor. Their floor is dirt,and when it rains, the house floods and it becomes mud. And my experience again and again is that some of the poorest people I found who are people of faith are the happiest and most grateful people I've ever encountered. And then I think in our culture of affluence here in the US we don't have cause to be grateful like they do because we just have so much stuff around us that can distract us from the need for being grateful. And so there's a sense of poverty where I know that I need God allows us to experience him even more and be grateful even more. And I also think that maybe unless you haven't had an encounter with God's love, it's hard to be grateful. And people who have been wounded have some barriers to that. And so I love working with those folks. And we are all wounded in some way. We all carry them. And so how can we take our wounds to Christ and let him heal them? And then our experience of that healing makes us more grateful. But I'm afraid that if we are wounded and don't ever let Christ heal us, it's hard to be grateful, hard to be joyful.

Christopher Beaudet: Right, Right. Because maybe you're concentrating on the wound, on the lack, on the deprivation, rather. And because of that focus, you're not set free to look at abundance.

Bishop James Golka: Yeah, I think so. I think some of the greatest blocks to the spiritual life in us,

lack of forgiveness. So a resentment just somehow blocked spiritual life from going through us. And then also just the desire or lust for something else out there that isn't God. And so we long for the wrong things to fill us up, and then we never get filled up by stuff of this world. It's only God's life that fills us up.

Christopher Beaudet: Well, let's pick up there in just a moment. I want to take a brief break,

and then when we come back, I want to talk about, again, living gratitude like your mother and father did, tips on how we can foster that and cultivate it. And also maybe what to do with our wounds is part of that overall process, if that's all right. So please stay with us. I'm speaking with Bishop James Golka, the Bishop of the Diocese of Colorado Springs on our theme How Can I Repay the Lord? Taken from Psalm 116. We will be right back.

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Christopher Beaudet: Thank you for staying with us. I'm speaking with Bishop James Gulka, the bishop of Colorado Springs, and we're discussing gratitude, living gratitude. And from the Psalm 116, how can I repay the Lord? The psalm answers it, taking up the cup of salvation, calling upon the name of the Lord, which I read, Bishop, as an act of worship, calling upon the name of the Lord,

not just, oh, God, please help me. You know, the beggar prayer, but here this seems to be just a prayer of praise.

Bishop James Golka: Yeah, Amen. And I think the Mass becomes that eventually for us when you encounter Christ and receive communion that he desires for you. We're returned to the Garden of Eden before the fall like this is. This is why God made us. He wants to be our friend. He wants us to be wed to him, if you will. And so that event of communion heals all the brokenness we have and brings us to a safe place during the Mass. I love the Doxology. Through him, with him, in him, unity of the Holy Spirit, all glory and honor is yours, Almighty Father. At that moment, we're standing in the middle of the Trinity and we get to see God face to face. And so then we call out to God in the Our Father, and then God feeds us and then we receive communion with him. And just liturgically, that if we let the Mass carry us, we're carried right into a place where you have to give God praise because you're in front of God, and then you have to tell him, thank you.

Christopher Beaudet: Right, right. You quoted Kevin Seasoltz earlier, who I think is a liturgical theologian, correct? 

Bishop James Golka: Yeah.

Christopher Beaudet: And so many references you've pointed to have been liturgical, just the prayer of the Mass itself. And it strikes me at, you know, there's the maxim in the tradition, lex orandi, lex credendi, the law, the norm of our prayer becomes the law of our living, the way we live. And of course, John Paul II always noted that, you know, at the heart of the word cultures is the Latin cultus worship. So a culture is really defined by the altar where it drops its grain of incense. And you mentioned before the break that, you know, sometimes we have this desire or lust for something which can become, I need the next experience. I need the next fill in the blank material object. I have to do X, Y, or Z. That can become its own kind of religious, dogmatic way of living. And you start worshiping more and more and more. And that's a challenge to gratitude. And then you also mentioned woundedness. And there might be some levels of culpability in these obstacles and maybe less. And others. Life can be difficult and challenging. How does somebody with these challenges help either heal them, fight them, offer them, not indulge them, et cetera, to become more grateful? I think everybody wants to be grateful. I don't know if anybody out there says, no, being grateful is not a good. I think that's a premise most people would accept that it is. Yet I think a lot of people might struggle to actually be grateful.

Bishop James Golka: Yeah, we're recording this in the season of Lent, and I think that's one reason the church gives us this season, because unless and until I do, you know, practices of charity and prayer, almsgiving, fasting, deny myself, pick up a cross, like all of those things, you don't find any of that in our culture. And so I just think that our culture pulls us away from our faith. It doesn't do much to enhance spirit. So you have to be intentional to. They really say, God, I want to know you better. And then I tell people, like, the practice of your Catholic faith is the best thing you can do to keep you safe, but also to fill you up with the gratitude and joy God wants you to have. I love the Gospel of John where Jesus says, I've told you all this, so my joy will be in you, and your joy will be complete. Like, I love that we have a God who wants us to know his complete joy. And so God wants to give that to us. But if I never go to God, if I never do those practices of charity or fast fasting or figuring out how can I die to myself to live for somebody else.

Christopher Beaudet: Right.

Bishop James Golka: And that's the definition of love, too, is I. I will the good of the other. I want to live for somebody else. Unless I do that, I'm never going to get it.

Christopher Beaudet: Yeah. And again, the theology of the Eucharist, right. I mean, the Last Supper was tied with the sacrifice of Christ on the cross, the Lamb of God, the New Covenant, gift of self. Total gift of self.

Bishop James Golka: Yeah. Yeah. And I always say that for me, it's all about Jesus Christ. And I love the Philippians hymn where Christ, though he was in the form of God, did not regard equality with God, something to be grasped. Rather, he emptied himself. So for me, that's it. He's got everything the Father wants him to have and he grasps none of it. He gives it all away. And I want that. I want to live that way. And he's the model for it. And I find that when I'm able to do that, maybe for five minutes a day only, but when I do that, I feel much closer to Christ. I feel his joy.

Christopher Beaudet: It's such a paradox, right. Like so much of divine revelation, the struggle of spirit and flesh that St. Paul talks about this paradox that what I really want to grab, I have trouble grabbing because my hands are already clutched onto something else. And it's the letting go that's really the fearful part.

Bishop James Golka: Yeah. And who in the Bible was the first one that tried to grasp equality with God? Adam and Eve, you know. They grab the apple.

Christopher Beaudet: Exactly.

Bishop James Golka: So, like Jesus attitude of emptying heals our original sin. It frees us from that.

Christopher Beaudet: Have you ever seen the movie the Mission?

Bishop James Golka: I have, yeah.

Christopher Beaudet: Yeah. There's the scene it's played. The former slave trader turned Jesuit, Robert De Niro, is so contrite for what he did and how he treated the native peoples. And he wanted to carry with him, drag behind him, really, a roughhewn net filled with Spanish colonial armor from the period accompanying his brother Jesuits climbing up the falls. And more than once, the Jesuits get frustrated with his penitential sort of remorse, because him dragging, that's dragging all of them trying to get to the peoples on this trek. So in frustration, one of the brother Jesuits takes his knife out and cuts it and pushes it all the way back down to the falls. And without a word, Robert De Niro goes back down, reties it and starts again. And it's only when he gets to the top and he's among the native peoples who he offended and they cut it loose and sent it over the falls, that he feels that beautiful moment of tears mixed with laughter. That just came to my mind because he has so much to be grateful for. And yet that past offense, that past life, was something he could not let go of, and it consumed him. So earlier you said lack of forgiveness, but we also have to have, I think, an openness to be forgiven by God as well. Correct. And that, to me, would be an ultimate experience of that. Of that joy. Like a weight going over the waterfall.

Bishop James Golka: Yeah. I think liturgically of the sacrament of confession, you know, and to see second graders come out of their first confession so joyful and happy, it's like a reminder that that's how we all should feel coming out of there. And, and people tell me that's one of their deepest moments of gratitude, is when they make a really good confession. And I love. You know, Saint Faustina calls the confessional the Tribunal of Mercy. Like, we all come in there, we're all guilty, and Jesus is like, yep, it's okay. I got it for you. I paid the price.

Christopher Beaudet: Right.

Bishop James Golka: You don't have to do jail time. I did that already. You're free now. And to know that in your bones, that's joy and gratitude.

Christopher Beaudet: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. And, you know, I put bubble gum in my. My sister's hair. We might chuckle at that. But for that second grader, there's a real acknowledgement. Like,

that was a wrong, and now I feel forgiven. Yeah, it's. It's. And again, you must be like a small child to enter the kingdom of heaven. So there they are. Watch a second grader coming out of their first confession. Like, there be like that.

Bishop James Golka: Amen.

Christopher Beaudet: It's a great image, Bishop, in the last couple of minutes here that we have, I'm just curious if you have any. We said earlier that, you know, there are a lot of resources for stewardship, and some of them might be resources that don't explicitly say stewardship. You know, even given our conversation, one could read pretty much anything about the Eucharist.

And you're basically reading about stewardship, about being a joyful gift giver, giving of the self. Right.

But for living joyfully, for exercising and developing the virtue of gratitude on the centrality of stewardship and the life of discipleship, what have you found to be some resources or books that you think are really valuable?

Bishop James Golka: Yeah. Thanks. If you allow me to return to the Eucharist again, please.

That's the school of stewardship. That's where we learn it. And so even the presentation of the gifts, you know, we give to God something that we helped make. We took God's gift of great and grape, and we helped make something different. And then you put it on the altar and you give it to God.

Then the Church calls the Holy Spirit upon it, and then God makes it infinitely better something of heaven. And then God gives it back to us. So that's the model. So bring every gift God has given you, give it to him, ask him to bless it, and he'll give it back to you even better. And then eucharistic ministers are extraordinary ministers of Holy Communion. What are they going to do? Something that's not theirs. A gift of God that gives salvation to others. And you get to just give that to people. And so those images always just strike my heart. So, yes, anything you can study on the Mass, I think will lead you to that. I love the bishop's document Stewardship: A Disciple’s Response. It's not a theologically dense, academic work. It's a prayerful consideration of what it means to be a disciple and a steward. And so I always say that if your church practice is not making you a better follower of Jesus, then re. Look at it again and find out how to make sure he's in front of you. Because if you're not growing closer to him, then it's not what the Church intends, I think. So. Anybody can pick up that book. It's very accessible.

Christopher Beaudet: And let me ask you this. Pardon me for interrupting, but the document from the USCCB you just mentioned about the disciples response, it's been around now for quite a long time.

Bishop James Golka: Yeah. 1992, I think.

Christopher Beaudet: Yeah. Is there any, are you aware of any movement or suggestion on the part of the Conference of Bishops to maybe address it again, but with a fresher new document? Or is it kind of like. No, it still pretty much says everything that needs to be said.

Bishop James Golka: I've not heard of any efforts to renew it, but I do hear many bishops reference how they continue to use it, and it continues to bear fruit.

That would be fun to revisit that someday.

Christopher Beaudet: Well, maybe you can head up the committee to do that.

Bishop James Golka: If that's what God desires, happy to do it.

Christopher Beaudet: Right, right. Any other sources? Yes.

Bishop James Golka: Yeah. A book that you wouldn't think by Esther de Waal called Seeking the Way of St. Benedict. And in that book, you just find traces of how to be a good steward. And the Benedictine spirituality does that. They put in place somebody whose Job is to take care of the goods of the monastery and make sure that they're given out freely and generously, but also wisely and prudently. And so that's spirituality. I enjoyed that book. It's a simple book that helped me understand stewardship and discipleship even more. Then two friends of mine have written a book, Eric and Lisa McCardle, and they have a book, Stewardship Success, a Practical Guide for Catholic Parishes.

And that kind of just spells out a way that a parish can do an annual plan of stewardship as a way, again, not to raise money, but to get people to pray more and then to be more involved in the life of the church and of the community. And when you do those things, then something happens in you, in the parish then. Lisa has also written a simple book, Stewardship Starts at Home by Lisa McCardell. And she has some great examples of just family living and what mom and dads can do in the home with your children. As I read that book, I thought of my own family and was filled with gratitude.

Gratitude for them.

Christopher Beaudet: Yeah, yeah, exactly. And that's, boy, what a gift to have parents who you know themselves live that. Which is a call to all Christian parents to live that gratitude in a habitual, virtuous way so that their children can observe.

Bishop James Golka: Yeah. Your children are watching you, mom and dad.

Christopher Beaudet: Right.

Bishop James Golka: And that's. They're going to learn faith from you. I remembered watching my dad on his knees praying. That just stayed with me. I thought that's how you do it.

Christopher Beaudet: Yep. Yeah, exactly.

Bishop James Golka: I would say one more book, too, that I ran across, the Catholic Vision for Leading Like Jesus. And it especially talks about servant, steward and shepherd. And just a very accessible, spirit filled book that as a priest, I remembered appreciating. But then our stewardship council studied the book and it was a book for everybody. And so servant, steward and shepherd are just three great images that help us better lead like Jesus and follow Jesus.

Christopher Beaudet: Who wrote that?

Bishop James Golka: Owen Phelps.

Christopher Beaudet: Okay. Okay, great. That's wonderful. Yeah. Again, there's probably a million more titles and angles and takes that we could take on this. I guess in closing, Bishop, your vision for your own diocese, you know, is to inculcate, inculcate stewardship and to foster that so that people experience the joy of the Lord. I know you're bishop of your diocese and not bishop of other dioceses, but if you could give a word of counsel or encouragement to your brother bishops in dioceses across the country along the walk of stewardship, the spirituality of stewardship, maybe hearken back to that pastor in western Nebraska who was a bit reticent and had to go to his bishop for some counsel. What might you say to your brother bishops in terms of leading and shepherding their diocese?

Bishop James Golka: Yeah. One thing that I've appreciated in a life of stewardship is like an annual renewal. So it means that annually I look at my own life, and then I bring it to the Lord, and then I beg him, show me a next step you want me to take. And I love that question, because you can ask it of a daily master goer, and you can ask it of someone who's been away for 30 years. What's the next step the Lord wants for you? And then it does take courage sometimes to take that step. If it's not something I had in mind, and if it's something uncomfortable, but I feel like the Lord's calling me to it, like, trust. And, you know, in Covid, I had the image of trust as I had to lean on the Lord all the way, that if he wasn't there, I would fall on my face. And when you lean on someone that much, at first, it's your tense, and you don't know if you can trust them. But then once you realize you can, you lean into him totally and you're free. And so I just encourage people to take a step of trust, get out of your comfort zone, and implore the Lord to show you the next step. And then do it. And you do that individually. A couple can do that in their marriage. A family can do it together, A pastor with his parish, a whole diocese. Like, if you take one step, and after almost 20 years of trying to be more intentional about this, I can look back and see at least 20 steps that I've taken that the Lord has blessed incredibly. And then I can't wait for the next 20. Yeah, there's gratitude and joy.

Christopher Beaudet: Yeah, that's wonderful. I had a spiritual director say to me once that the fruit of prayer is not clarity, but trust. And I hated it when he said it.

Bishop James Golka: Well, my joke, and it's not a joke, is I thought I trusted the Lord totally, and then he made me a bishop.

Christopher Beaudet: Yeah, exactly.

Bishop James Golka: So I had to learn all over again. And it's rarely comfortable, but it's always good to have to trust the Lord again.

Christopher Beaudet: Well, every journey of every prophet in the Old Testament started with one step. And they wanted to know the whole game plan. Where am I going? Well, that will be revealed to you later. Well, Bishop, it's a delight to speak with you about these themes of gratefulness and stewardship and for the ways that you live that out yourself and encourage those in the diocese.

The people of God entrusted to your pastoral care were really very grateful. And thank you for all of the ways that you've have been a shepherd and a teacher of the truths of the faith and especially around these themes in conferences and retreats and in many other venues. So very appreciative.

Bishop James Golka: Yeah, thanks. None of that was my plan, so I appreciate God for God's plan. His plan is always better, and I'm so grateful for that. And thank you, Christopher, for the time and for all that you do and all that Steier does.

Christopher Beaudet: Thank you. I appreciate that. Bishop. Thank you.

What a blessing to spend some time with Bishop Golka and to hear how the church's liturgy, especially of the Eucharist, can teach us so much about how to live like Christ, or in other words,

how to live a life for others so that we grow in gratitude and gratitude. Gratitude's ever present companion, joy. Speaking of gratitude, thank you for joining us today for this episode with Bishop Golka. You are cordially invited to subscribe to our podcast so that you can be sure to join us every month for more great conversations like today's. That's a wrap for this episode of Twelve Wicker Baskets. Until we meet again next month, know of our gratitude for you and our wish that you have every blessing.